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PostPosted: Mon Jan 23, 2017 12:11 pm 
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Hey guys, first I would like to say THANKS!!! Ive read through this forum for years taking notes along the way. Ive read all the suggested books and papers and I feel like I have enough of a grasp on studio design to give it a go. I have attached a image of a basic studio layout I made with information I gained here. I know it will not please all BUT thats ok! lol... This will be built from scratch using the room in a room concept, in a building detached from my house. The finished ceiling height will be 12 feet high. I forgot to include that in the drawing. No room treatment is included bc I plan to measure the room after sheetrock and then plan my treatments. This will primarily be a MIX / Production room. Tracking vocals more often then not, Tracking drums a few times a year. I listen LOUD. My speakers are Dual Loaded TAD 1601B's with TAD 4002 Compression Drivers and TAD 1801's on the left and right side for SUBS. All powered by bryston. All speakers will be soffit mounted. Let me know if you guys see anything that doesn't make sense. (Sorry for my lack of sketch up knowledge)

Thanks!


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PostPosted: Sun Jan 29, 2017 1:33 am 
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Hi there " kevspence2", and welcome to the forum! :)

Now that we have cleaned the scum spammer out of your thread, and shoveled out the muck he left behind, we can get down to looking at your studio!

Quote:
I have attached a image of a basic studio layout I made with information I gained here.
I would suggest that you do all your sketches in SketchUp! It's an amazing tool. It takes a while to get started, but once you are over the initial learning curve, you'll start seeing the power and just how useful it is. There's many things about your layout that don't add up, and it seems that's partly due to you trying to do things on paper with numbers and angles that sound nice, but without checking if the geometry actually works in real life.

Quote:
This will be built from scratch using the room in a room concept, in a building detached from my house.
How big is the building, and what is the current construction? How much space do you have?

Also, you say that you are using the "room in a room" concept, but that is not evident at all from your diagram. In only see single-framed walls, with no hint of how you will handle the decoupling. I'd suggest that you should start detailing how you plan to do that.... and as soon as you do, you'll start to see the limitations and drawbacks of the layout you have at present.

Quote:
The finished ceiling height will be 12 feet high.
That implies a building height of about 16 to 18 feet, or perhaps more if you have a highly gabled roof. Have you done elevation views of how that will look? I have e feeling it will be out of proportion, visually, for that shape and size of building.

Quote:
No room treatment is included bc I plan to measure the room after sheetrock and then plan my treatments.
That would be a mistake! Treatment is an integral part of the design of a room, and has to be taken into account right from the start. FOr example, how will you know where you can put doors and windows, if you don't yet know what treatment you will be using, nor where it will need to be? This is already evident in your current layout: you have one half of the main access door into the control room, exactly at the point where your rear superchunk bass traps will need to be.

Yes, it is important to measure the actual room response once the room is built, and compare that against the predicted response, but only to see what adjustments will be needed in the treatment plan. If you don't allow for basic treatment in the initial design, you will end up having to demolish things to fit it in later. Either that, or end up with a room that is way less than what it could have been.

Quote:
My speakers are Dual Loaded TAD 1601B's with TAD 4002 Compression Drivers
Well, yes, but those are not speakers! They are just drivers. What cabinet will you be mounting them in? What design? What frequency response will that have? What crossover? What Q? What dispersion vertically and horizontally? Where will the acoustic axis be? What dimensions will the cabinet have? How heavy? You will need to know all of that in order to design the soffits and the treatment for the room. Specifying only the drivers for your room, is sort of like saying you are going to buy a car, but the only part of it that you are certain about is the carburetor...

Quote:
I listen LOUD.
How loud? That's like saying "I drive FAST!". But "fast" for a little old lady on her way to the supermarket might be 30 MPH, while even 250 MPH might not be "fast" for Nico Rosberg. "Fast#" and "loud" are subjective, relative terms. You need to put that into objective real-world numbers. When you say "LOUD", do you mean 120 dBC? Or do you mean 65 dBA? Both could be considered "loud", depending on the circumstances, even though one is several thousand times louder than the other.

Quote:
All speakers will be soffit mounted.
Then how come that is not shown in the diagram? There's no provision at all for that, and no place to accomplish it without making major modifications to the design.

Quote:
Let me know if you guys see anything that doesn't make sense.
I'm wondering about the rather strange shape of the control room. There's a lot of sizes and angles in there that don't make a lot of sense, and a lot of wasted space. For example, why is there an exact 12° angle in the middle of the rear wall? And why is it concave? Concave surfaces tend to focus and concentrate sound, but the rear wall should be scattering and dissipating sound. That wall is going to cause SBIT issues that are more intense than usual, and more difficult to deal with. And why 12°? Why not 10°, or 15°?

Also, based on those angles and dimensions, the mix position is going to be way too far forward in the room, with a very tiny sweet spot, and narrow sound-stage. You say you want to soffit-mount your speakers, but why not just do that with a conventional layout for the room?

Finally, there's a serious issue with your numbers and angles: They don't add up! :shock:

I tired to draw exactly what you show, using your exact angles and dimensions, and this is what I get:

Attachment:
Mangled-geometry.png


It's an mangled set of numbers. They don't work. There's something major wrong there!

If you use SketchUp, it is impossible to make a mistake like that. On paper, it's dead easy.

One other major issue: I don't see any provision for HVAC. HVAC always takes up a LOT of space in a studio, and absolutely must be included, in detail, in the original plan.


- Stuart -


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PostPosted: Thu Feb 02, 2017 7:51 am 
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Thanks Soundman! This is exactly the input I was looking for. Clearly I made a few errors in the first drawing (thanks for catching).. I have attached corrections and adjustments. I would like to get the basic geometry right before continuing. The building doesnt exist yet. I am also building a house at the same time so I will be working with my architect, studio builder and acoustician to complete the documentation for construction. As I said before I plan to use the room with in a room concept double walls with 2X6 24" OC. I will use the design diagrams and techniques I learned from Rod Gervais's Book and follow it closely. I will be using an experienced studio builder and acoustician here in Atlanta to perfect my design once I am satisfied with the basics. My goal here is not to get to a complete set of drawings on my own, but to simply make sure the angles and room volumes are practical for my intended use. The main speaker system will be a George Augspurger style system. The architect will consult directly with the studio builder about the front wall design within the parameters I am laying out. The builder has built many of the professional rooms around Atlanta and I am very familiar with his work. He not a designer tho and I do not want a simple copy of the other rooms he has built in the past, hence why I am working on the basics of the layout myself.


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PostPosted: Tue Sep 24, 2019 3:14 am 
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:yahoo: :yahoo: :yahoo: :yahoo: :yahoo: :yahoo: :yahoo:

Its here!!!!

I was able to make some of the suggested changes. Took about a year of straight construction to make it this far (built a house on the same property at the same time) and did most of the construction and finishing myself. I Had a mix project I couldn't pass on pop up before I could finish the inside. I mixed a whole album in this condition and believe it or not is sounds good. Haven't done any measurements yet. Its a little lively but it didn't keep me from turning out a fine product. Thanks Soundman for the input. I am about to start the room treatment phase. My biggest delay has been figuring out what exactly I want the vibe / look of the room to be. I think I've got a pretty good Idea. I'll continue to update this thread as I go along. Again, thanks for all the input thus far. I will have plenty of questions nailing down the room treatment.


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PostPosted: Thu Sep 26, 2019 7:59 pm 
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that looks nice and good if it sounds nice also!

Sorry for stupid questions, but what is that space around media room used for?
isnt it normally filled/used for bass trapping etc?
Most of the rooms I see here have a lot less angles on walls (or they are made with sound treatment materials)
is this space going to get lot smaller after adding all the room treatment and is the rooms shape going to change with it?


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PostPosted: Wed Oct 02, 2019 2:54 pm 
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anodivirta wrote:
that looks nice and good if it sounds nice also!

Sorry for stupid questions, but what is that space around media room used for?
isnt it normally filled/used for bass trapping etc?
Most of the rooms I see here have a lot less angles on walls (or they are made with sound treatment materials)
is this space going to get lot smaller after adding all the room treatment and is the rooms shape going to change with it?


Thanks! Most of the space behind the front wall will be taken up by the soffit mounted speaker boxes. Other space is incidental as the outside shell is a rectangle vs it following the shape of the room.


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PostPosted: Wed Oct 02, 2019 4:20 pm 
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kevspence2 wrote:
anodivirta wrote:
that looks nice and good if it sounds nice also!

Sorry for stupid questions, but what is that space around media room used for?
isnt it normally filled/used for bass trapping etc?
Most of the rooms I see here have a lot less angles on walls (or they are made with sound treatment materials)
is this space going to get lot smaller after adding all the room treatment and is the rooms shape going to change with it?


Thanks! Most of the space behind the front wall will be taken up by the soffit mounted speaker boxes. Other space is incidental as the outside shell is a rectangle vs it following the shape of the room.

ok, I didnt at first see the soffits but now it makes more sense :D


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PostPosted: Fri Nov 22, 2019 12:29 pm 
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Progress Report 1

built soffits for bass traps in the control room,

built and hung cloud in booth,

built a 2D Diffuser for the control room back wall,

had my electrician buddy Tyler come hang and wire some recessed lights and track lights.

Attachment:
IMG-0760.JPG
Attachment:
soffit 2.JPG
Attachment:
soffit 3.JPG
Attachment:
IMG-soffit electrical 2.JPG
Attachment:
booth cloud electrical 1.JPG
Attachment:
saw gang.JPG
Attachment:
cutt blocks for difussor.JPG
Attachment:
difussor start 1.JPG
Attachment:
1 difussor square.JPG
Attachment:
difussor hang 1.JPG
Attachment:
difussor hang 2.JPG
Attachment:
difusser hung.JPG
Attachment:
tyler 2.JPG


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PostPosted: Sat Nov 23, 2019 6:27 am 
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Location: St. Albert, Alberta, Canada
It looks beautiful. That high ceiling is killer!

Greg

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