John Sayers' Design Forum

John Sayers' Recording Studio Design Forum

A World of Experience
Click Here for Information on John's Services
It is currently Tue Mar 09, 2021 11:20 am

All times are UTC + 10 hours




Post new topic Reply to topic  [ 42 posts ]  Go to page Previous  1, 2, 3  Next
Author Message
PostPosted: Mon Mar 09, 2020 11:32 am 
Offline

Joined: Thu Jun 05, 2014 2:56 pm
Posts: 37
Location: Sunshine Coast, QLD, Australia
I managed to get the first couple of ceiling panels installed over the weekend. Also built a silencer box on the outside of the extended wall.

Attachment:
ceiling panel.jpg


Many more to build, but it feels good getting a start on it.


You do not have the required permissions to view the files attached to this post.


Report this post
Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Progress, progress...
PostPosted: Mon Apr 06, 2020 11:14 am 
Offline

Joined: Thu Jun 05, 2014 2:56 pm
Posts: 37
Location: Sunshine Coast, QLD, Australia
Been slow progress, but things are moving forward.

I am about 99% finished boxing up the ceiling, I just have a couple of panels that still need doubling with green glue in between:
Attachment:
IMG_2900.JPG

I've done a first round of sealing up tiny gaps with sikaflex so the ceiling would be close to airtight, but I plan on doing another round to make sure absolutely everything is airtight.

Starting installing sealed boxes to go behind the switches and outlets and have started the pre-wire:
Attachment:
IMG_2898.JPG

These boxes will also be filled with insulation, closed on the front and sealed to the gyprok when it's installed.

And yellowtongue flooring on top of mass loaded rubber is now in place:
Attachment:
IMG_2901.JPG

I will also fill up the gap around the outside with sikaflex. I tried to leave a couple of mm tolerance around the flooring for movement and weather changes. I figured flooring first and gyprock over the top of the flooring again with maybe a 1-2mm gap filling with sikaflex to keep things airtight but mildly flexible.


You do not have the required permissions to view the files attached to this post.


Report this post
Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Tue Apr 07, 2020 4:48 am 
Offline
Moderator
User avatar

Joined: Wed Feb 01, 2017 6:03 pm
Posts: 1501
Location: St. Albert, Alberta, Canada
Wow. That's a lot of hard work and it looks great! Excited to see more progress pics. I think showing your build in more detail (pictures) would help people in the future. Again, good work!

Greg

_________________
It appears that you've made the mistake most people do. You started building without consulting this forum.


Report this post
Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Tue Apr 14, 2020 12:20 pm 
Offline

Joined: Thu Jun 05, 2014 2:56 pm
Posts: 37
Location: Sunshine Coast, QLD, Australia
A little more progress over the weekend, but still a bit of tidying up details before plaster can go up.

This is the front wall behind where the monitor soffits will be. timber in the middle is for screens to be mounted to the wall. The electrical going horizontally is power being fed into a switch and then to outlets for the audio monitors. The same switch also powers another socket at the back of the room that will supply a ventilation fan pushing air into the room through a silencer duct. The idea is that if you power up the monitors then you've also powered up the ventilation fan. There is ventilation ducts that will go up into the soffits and then past the rear of the monitors into outlets in the ceiling that also push through another silencer duct each.
Attachment:
frontwall.jpg


Also completed another silencer to go in the ceiling before we hang the drywall. It's heavy and has been designed to fit through the manhole so I might have to enlist some help to get it up there.

This is an in progress shot, I didn't get one of the closed up box
Attachment:
silencer.jpg


I put my iphone in one end, sealed it up and played music through it. Not very scientific but gives me an idea on how effective or not my silencer is. Works really well on the top end, but I can still hear a fair bit below 250hz through it. Could have been the phone actually vibrating the structure itself as it was sitting inside but I guess I'll find out! Worst comes to worst I can build an extension to it at some point. The whole thing makes a great low pass filter.


You do not have the required permissions to view the files attached to this post.


Report this post
Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Wed Apr 15, 2020 4:44 am 
Offline
Moderator
User avatar

Joined: Wed Feb 01, 2017 6:03 pm
Posts: 1501
Location: St. Albert, Alberta, Canada
Quote:
This is the front wall behind where the monitor soffits will be. timber in the middle is for screens to be mounted to the wall.

What type of material is that? It looks like particle board. I recommend OSB. You don't want your screen pulling out of it!

Quote:
This is an in progress shot, I didn't get one of the closed up box

I don't see any caulk in the joints. I assume you applied a bunch around the outside at least?

Quote:
Works really well on the top end, but I can still hear a fair bit below 250hz through it.

The low end attenuation is mostly obtained through impedance mismatch. That is when the cross sectional area doubles (or more) in size. Your inlet/outlet look to be roughly the same size as the path throughout your box. Care to share your measurements?

Greg

_________________
It appears that you've made the mistake most people do. You started building without consulting this forum.


Report this post
Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Wed Apr 15, 2020 6:19 am 
Offline

Joined: Thu Jun 05, 2014 2:56 pm
Posts: 37
Location: Sunshine Coast, QLD, Australia
The particleboard looking stuff is yellowtongue flooring material. Very dense and pretty dang strong. I’ve using it a bunch because of its density although I’m just using it because it’s strong and I have some left haha.

I haven’t built silencer boxes before and I didn’t realize that impedence mismatch was what attenuated the low end. Aaaah always something to learn! I can’t remember the measurements off hand and that thing is sitting in the ceiling now. I’ll have to climb up with a tape measure. I have the space in the ceiling so I could potentially add another section if I need to. There will effectively be an impedence mismatch where the ventilation opens up into the front monitor soffit. Can you recommend any reading on the impedence mismatch?

Thanks again.


Report this post
Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Wed Apr 15, 2020 7:47 am 
Offline
Moderator
User avatar

Joined: Wed Feb 01, 2017 6:03 pm
Posts: 1501
Location: St. Albert, Alberta, Canada
Quote:
There will effectively be an impedence mismatch where the ventilation opens up into the front monitor soffit. Can you recommend any reading on the impedence mismatch?

For sure there is one as it enters the room. Basically, the inside path of the box should be at least twice the size of the duct feeding the box.

You can see in the image below that like any broadband acoustic panel or a bass trap, the deeper the insulation (in this case, duct liner) is, the better it is at attenuating low frequencies:
Attachment:
Silencer Box Lining Thickness Attenuation.png

And you can see here how the insertion loss is directly proportional to the cross sectional delta:
Attachment:
Insertion Loss Graph from Engineering Acoustics 2009.png

Greg


You do not have the required permissions to view the files attached to this post.

_________________
It appears that you've made the mistake most people do. You started building without consulting this forum.


Report this post
Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Thu Apr 16, 2020 10:44 am 
Offline

Joined: Thu Jun 05, 2014 2:56 pm
Posts: 37
Location: Sunshine Coast, QLD, Australia
Thanks Greg, that's so helpful!


Report this post
Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: slow progress!
PostPosted: Wed Apr 29, 2020 4:46 pm 
Offline

Joined: Thu Jun 05, 2014 2:56 pm
Posts: 37
Location: Sunshine Coast, QLD, Australia
Despite work being very busy at the moment, I'm still managing to get quite a bit done in the studio.

I really can't get this done fast enough. My wife is getting plenty of voice work doing reads for government ads around the coronavirus outbreak and I knocked up a makeshift cupboard booth in about 10 minutes with zero isolation.

Attachment:
IMG_2997.JPG


Currently running an SM7 as it is pretty decent at being direct into some JLM baby animal pres into a zoom recorder.

So just outside the studio I put a downlight into the hallway as now there's a new wall blocking the window it was getting pretty dark. As you can see, the first layer of drywall is up.
Attachment:
IMG_2993.JPG

I need to confess that I'm an absolute rookie at doing drywall so it's all trial and error for me. Figuring that I want the most rigid wall I can get for acoustic reasons, I used both screws and drywall glue. The mud around the joints and edges is there purely to seal up the wall and make everything airtight as there's another layer with green glue to go over all of this. Also it gave me an opportunity to get a feel for mudding to give me the best opportunity to get the final drywall layer right. Something tells me i'm going to be doing a lot of sanding! :shock:
The product is 16mm Knauf FireShield with a weight of 13kg per sq meter. Because it's a fire product, it has fibreglass in it which makes it slightly more annoying to handle than standard gypsum as it can make you a little itchy if you rub cut edges on your skin.

This is my nightmare window that you face as you walk in
Attachment:
IMG_2996.JPG

I haven't even finished the first plaster layer yet and I can hear the isolation ramping up with each sheet and as a consequence my ears keep coming back to the window. I will definitely have to invest in a proper window.

Front wall with wiring for soffit mounted monitors and desk.
Attachment:
IMG_2995.JPG


Back corner up to the ceiling modules
Attachment:
IMG_2994.JPG

Everything from the roof truss up will be above the ceiling line and filled with insulation. I am not planning to plaster in the ceiling modules as I need the trapping space, any stray noise would need to make it through a foot of batts and also it'd be a real pain of a job hahaha.

I still need to penetrate my new silencer box into the space about the right hand side soffit and then plaster around that so lots of work to go before I can start on the second layer of drywall. Never ending!


You do not have the required permissions to view the files attached to this post.


Report this post
Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Tue May 05, 2020 3:52 am 
Offline
Moderator
User avatar

Joined: Wed Feb 01, 2017 6:03 pm
Posts: 1501
Location: St. Albert, Alberta, Canada
You're working fast! I'm impressed!

I'm no expert with drywall but I'll share what I know. For mudding the drywall, the key is to use the right stuff and to apply thin layers and trowel is as close to a finished product as you can. For your first layer, use a joint compound that is designed to glue tape down. Again, this can be a very thin coat. Lightly sand it to get rid of any huge bumps but you don't have to worry too much at this stage. For the second, third, fourth, etc stages, use a "light sanding" type of mud. This stuff isn't as strong so it's very easy to sand smooth. Using your trowel, apply a thin layer of mud and take your time to make it as smooth, clean and awesome as you can. If there are voids, try to fill them but don't worry if it's not happening. The less mud you have on means the less sanding you have to do. Literally, you should only have to sand a handful of swipes with some 220 grit. This is evident when you watch a pro mudder just swipe their way across the wall a few times and it's done. Add as many thin layers as you need to get the finish you're after. Typically a total of 3 layers should yield an awesome look. Sorry in advance if my advice is not great.

Greg

_________________
It appears that you've made the mistake most people do. You started building without consulting this forum.


Report this post
Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Tue May 26, 2020 3:43 pm 
Offline

Joined: Thu Jun 05, 2014 2:56 pm
Posts: 37
Location: Sunshine Coast, QLD, Australia
Forgot to get pictures, but now I'm about 20% into the second layer of drywall with green glue in between. Can't wait to be done with the drywall and onto the acoustic treatment and fun stuff.


Report this post
Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Wed May 27, 2020 10:46 am 
Offline

Joined: Thu Jun 05, 2014 2:56 pm
Posts: 37
Location: Sunshine Coast, QLD, Australia
Here are a couple of progress pics
Attachment:
IMG_3109.JPG

Attachment:
IMG_3110.JPG


Things are starting to cruise along nicely. As this is the last layer of drywall I'm trying to make it as neat and tidy as I can so that mudding it won't be too difficult. My wife is especially looking forward to helping me lift up that next sheet onto the wall hahaha. Looks like I'll run out of green glue this week as I cleaned out my local supplier. Going to try and find some in Brisbane so will go for a drive.

On the one external wall of this room I am going to do 3 layers (instead of 2) of the 16mm heavy drywall with green glue in between as the external cladding doesn't have great acoustic properties so it will likely be the second weakest point of this build. The window being the weakest until I can afford to upgrade.


You do not have the required permissions to view the files attached to this post.


Report this post
Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Mon Aug 10, 2020 4:51 pm 
Offline

Joined: Thu Jun 05, 2014 2:56 pm
Posts: 37
Location: Sunshine Coast, QLD, Australia
Been busy, but slow on the updates.

Finished plastering and have undercoated the room:
Attachment:
WindowAfterUndercoat.JPG

Attachment:
FrontWall.JPG


Progress of another silencer for the air inlet of the room:
Attachment:
SilencerProgress.JPG


All quite boring, but slowly progressing


You do not have the required permissions to view the files attached to this post.


Report this post
Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Mon Aug 10, 2020 5:01 pm 
Offline

Joined: Thu Jun 05, 2014 2:56 pm
Posts: 37
Location: Sunshine Coast, QLD, Australia
On the weekend I got started on a hybrid QRD/bass trap.

This treatment idea is inspired by the myroom design concept - https://www.gearslutz.com/board/studio- ... esign.html - Most of the hosting for the info on this has since expired and it's harder to find the AES paper without paying for it, but I had saved the pdf's locally some time ago.

The basic idea is that a QRD diffusor and hermholz got freaky and made a baby. So instead of the diffusor having fins in between the wells, you leave slots so that air can make it's way through. Behind the QRD you have a sealed space full of absorption. Useful calculator specifically for this idea: http://actools.tunetown.de/prn/

Anyways, I haven't finished yet, but this is the progress. Missing one blade and the top.
Attachment:
TimberLaidOut.JPG

Attachment:
HalfAssembled.JPG


You do not have the required permissions to view the files attached to this post.


Report this post
Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Tue Aug 11, 2020 10:51 am 
Offline

Joined: Thu Jun 05, 2014 2:56 pm
Posts: 37
Location: Sunshine Coast, QLD, Australia
The finished(-ish) diffusor for the back wall
Attachment:
finishedQRD.JPG

Attachment:
fromtheside.JPG


This will be recessed into the back wall with an airtight sealed box behind it with insulation batts inside. There will be fabric over the slots on the rear to stop the batts escaping. I will probably put another timber strap across the middle back of the diffusor to make sure the fins stay nice and straight and don't banana. There are a couple that are slightly bent that I'd like to make a bit straighter for cosmetic reasons.


You do not have the required permissions to view the files attached to this post.


Report this post
Top
 Profile  
 
Display posts from previous:  Sort by  
Post new topic Reply to topic  [ 42 posts ]  Go to page Previous  1, 2, 3  Next

All times are UTC + 10 hours


Who is online

Users browsing this forum: Exabot [Bot] and 44 guests


You cannot post new topics in this forum
You cannot reply to topics in this forum
You cannot edit your posts in this forum
You cannot delete your posts in this forum
You cannot post attachments in this forum

Jump to:  
Powered by phpBB® Forum Software © phpBB Group