John Sayers' Recording Studio Design Forum

That's funny! And cool!

Yes, I agree with all of that. Moemedi, see those walls you guys built? you need a ceiling that is just has massive as that. Otherwise, there's no point at all to having walls that heavy. You may as well have built a tin shed. This is what we sometimes called the "weakest link" effect. In terms of isolation, if you build wonderful walls and a crappy ceiling, you're going to have crappy results.

I also think you need to be aware of the acoustic ramifications of having an angled ceiling where, in your control room especially, your ceiling would be higher on the left than on the right (or vice versa). Your ceiling should be symmetrical. Having it rise behind you is OK, but having it rise to the side of you is not. I'm by no means an acoustics expert, but this much I do know.

--Keith

_________________
"Converting a garage into living space requires a city permit . . . homeowners insurance won't cover a structure that's been changed without a building permit . . ." --Sacramento Bee, May 27, 2006

Yeah - what keith said - slope the ceiling so it is lowest above the speakers and highest above the couch end.

cheers
john

Hi every one,

I have been thinking about the roof and I know that seemed like I had wanted to just put corrugated iron sheets but I have attached an example of the roof that I was thinking for THe control room. I would like to Know if this will also apply to the booth too, but that would men the slope is at an angle not like that of the control room. But the booth will have more than one ceiling too, just as many as the control room.

I was thinking to increase the hight of the wall in the control room so that there will be enough space high wise. But you can have a look at the pics that I have put together.

Because of having more than one wall, i could remove some bricks like Keith had said to support the ceilings, there for ceiling 1,2 in both the control room and the booth.

I am not sure if we have the material, that you apply on iron shets to reduce the noise, I will try and get to the hardware as soon as possible to hear if they have it or not.

Thanks hope to hear from you all soon, I am sorry I took a long time to reply.

Bless

Moemedi

Hi every One

We broke the walls over the weekend and this is how it looks now. I think that we must continue building the wall to into the new extension of the control room, (where the couch will be) so that the wall will be able to support the ceilings there for it will reduce the measuresments that I have specified 5760mm and shall be reduced to 5530mm, therefore the studio area will be 4000mm x 5530mm once another 230mm wall has been built.

I may be away for a while but will check the connection from Gaborone where I shall be, for a few days but will be able to answer all things from there I think.


Thanx

MOemedi Ramogapi
FOr Ruff Riddims

Wow, that had to be painful! Were you crying the entire time?

Too bad you don't have pictures of the demolition!

Hey, it could be worse -- you could have discovered this forum after the ceilings were built!

Keep up the good work!

--Keith

_________________
"Converting a garage into living space requires a city permit . . . homeowners insurance won't cover a structure that's been changed without a building permit . . ." --Sacramento Bee, May 27, 2006

Hi

I am sorry that I didnt put the pictures in, I asked some people that where looking for a small job to help with the demolition. I am glad that I found the forum before I had put the Ceiling, It this ceiling on the right track?

I hope to get some plans so that I can start working on the studio and getting the right people to build it, becoz, I dont know any thing about carpentry so I will ask a local school to help mi out. But I am not worried about the cost of Demolition, I just want to do the right thing all the way.

THanks

Moemedi

FOr Ruff Riddims

Hi

John, I was wondering if we could start building and try so that we can try and put the roof. I think that we should put a 230mm wall in the areas where storeroom was so that we can be able support the roof there. then have a number of ceiling.

I cannot find rock wool any where in Botswana, I have been trying to get orders and no one is getting back to me. So would working with fibreglass alone work?

THanks

MOemedi

Moemedi, is it possible to extend that existing roof all the way to the front of the control room like this

cheers
john

This is a three leaf ceiling...



That's not good.

That's the problem with corregated metal roofs. There have been several threads here where corregated metal was considered and then abandoned once the reality was known.

One possibility would be to use the corregated metal as your uppermost leaf, but keep the area between upper and middle leaf very well vented. Maybe this would help to lessen the third leaf effect...

In general, three leaf designs should be avoided if possible. Sometimes it gets difficult in buildings that are already built... But you're building this one now, so I would think you would want to avoid the third leaf problem altogether.

--Keith

_________________
"Converting a garage into living space requires a city permit . . . homeowners insurance won't cover a structure that's been changed without a building permit . . ." --Sacramento Bee, May 27, 2006

hi John and Keith

I think that it is possible, I was thinking that the roof of the control room would end at 3100mm as you have shown it.

I have been talking to the builder and asking him if it would be possible to increase the hight of the control room room, so that the roof becomes higher than the existing room.

But if the roof will work at 3100mm then it will be okay. i think that the roof will end at 3100mm at the same point where the exisiting roof ends.

The control room roof would have to slope in a different direction, it will slope in the same way that you have drawn it. i hope I am making sense. The slope that you have drawn is the sane way that we have been thinking about sloping the roof. We could raise it higher in the control room so that there is more space for ceilings in the control room. The builder would have to build some more so that the panks and roof can be supported.

Keith, so I would have to use a different roofing material like roofing tiles? would they have to be clay tiles or they could be metal tiles that have some rough tiles texture.

thanks

Moemedi

I would think clay tiles would be a closer match to your clay brick walls. But, they wouldn't be air tight, which would be a problem.

I really don't know how to advise you here. I'll point a few others from the Construction forum to your thread here in the Design forum.

--Keith

_________________
"Converting a garage into living space requires a city permit . . . homeowners insurance won't cover a structure that's been changed without a building permit . . ." --Sacramento Bee, May 27, 2006

Moemedi - this is how I'd approach your ceiling. It's a sketchup file so you may need to download the free program.

cheers
john

to the construction section of the forum Hi JOHN!!!

WOW!! Looks really great.

I have been moving around the hardware stores and they don’t seem to have RCs in any of them. Would using wooden purlines (battens) change the way thing will sound or work? They would be able to cut the battens to the size possibly similar to that of the RCs. Maybe you could supply mi with the measurements of the RCs that you would suggest using.

I would like to make sure about the things that you have listed to use.

Plaster, is this the actual ceiling board? I have attached a picture of what I thought you where referring to. Here they call it Rhino board, I am not sure it they call it Rhino as a product or they call it rhino because it’s a brand, like people calling all tooth paste colgate.

The ext roof, does this refer to Chipboard? Or should block board be used. It looks like there are two layers of ext roof shown in the google sketch up, is that correct. On any board with a sizable thickness can be used?

How should the booth roof be? Should it be the same just that it has to cover the area of the booth and that the slope will not be the same as in the control room due to size?

How many down lights would be suitable for the area of the Control room and for the booth? I have already purchased 20 down lights some time back. I think
20 down lights will be too much for the area, could use them in other parts of the building.

Would the electrical piping and cables run in between the RC and the insulation?

There is no rock wool any where in Botswana, no hardware has it and it is proving to be very hard to get a hold of. Is fibreglass okay to use. I know rock would have been idea to use, but there is none in Botswana. Should I use fibreglass?

When can I start working on the roof? And or should I wait for all the designs to be finished? And will this Thread move.

Thanks
MOemedi Ramogapi

yes Moemedi - rhino is plaster. That looks like it's only about 10mm so you will probably need two layers of it.

Yes - that chipboard is OK for the upper layer and I'd use two layers there also.

If you can't get RC just use timber battens as you suggested.

I continue the roof all the way to the end of the building over the booth but you can't use downlights in the ceiling as it will break the seal and render the ceiling useless. You'll have to make some drop ceiling panels to mount the downlights.

If you can't get rockwool then use fiberglass doubled.

cheers
john

Only two?


Only two?

Also, I think that chipboard is what we call "MDF." (Or is it? )


How come RC is even being discussed here at all? Isn't he doing separate walls and supporting a separate ceiling on his inner walls anyway? Isn't RC not needed/desired in that case?

--Keith

_________________
"Converting a garage into living space requires a city permit . . . homeowners insurance won't cover a structure that's been changed without a building permit . . ." --Sacramento Bee, May 27, 2006