Farmhouse home studio construction

limsa-terry · **Posted:** Wed Feb 15, 2012 4:59 pm

aaronsommer wrote:

Do you think or did you a calculation? Your slat panels are looking really thin but if they are 2cm thick you have 111hz on the deepest side and 200hz on the small angle. This is not as bad... Or how thick ware your slat panels?

My slat panels are only 15mm thick. If I played correctly with hemholz calculator my resonators are still going to low enough 117Hz.
But is that sufficient? That's a another question. Maybe there needs to be more of 120mm slats and 2,5mm slots..
I have now 120mm slat, 10mm slot, 30mm slat, 10mm slot, 120mm slat, 2,5mm slot, 70mm slat, 5mm slot, 30mm slat, 5mm slot, 70mm slat, 2,5mm slot, 120mm slat etc etc... That's the pattern.

aaronsommer wrote:

yes this is a good idea. I finished the border yet and tomorrow i will cut the slats.

I can't wait to see it finished and measured :wink:

aaronsommer wrote:

I'm curious too and am looking forward to see the measures. You might do one reference measure next time without rockwool that we can compare more easily :wink:

I'll take new measures today including the reference measure without rockwool bats

Bill Pillmore wrote:

Have you tried swapping L and R speakers?

Actually I did, just for curiosity if there's any differences between the speakers.. No there isn't

Thanks,
-Janne

aaronsommer · **Posted:** Wed Feb 15, 2012 6:58 pm

xSpace wrote:

aaronsommer wrote:

Again, all theory. I did not build this foil absorber myself yet but reading good things about it.

Best regards
Aaron

I guess I am saying this. In order for a membrane to work it has to be tuned from the start.

So if you use a steel plate or an aluminum veneered product or plywood, you still require the numbers on either of these materials to make an accurate panel, right?

So, rather than deviate with unknown properties, stick with what you can verify.

Unless you can verify the properties from the start, it's all guess work. And aluminum is highly, highly reflective in the high end, so while you could get lucky and produce a panel that actually resonates.

Brien,
Yes i know that it has to be tuned from start. The foil i talked from is detailed descripted onto the page i linked and the kg/qm that is needed to calculate the resonance of the foil/plate is also standing there - 6kg/qm instead of 4mm plywood 2,4kg/qm. I did not talk from aluminum. The formula to calc this foil resonator is the same as the one of the plate resonator.
And like you say an aluminum plate is high reflective cause of its material stiffness and the converse argument is that foil wound be as high reflective. Summary this Foil resonator is actually the same as the plate resonator but using a resonance calculated acoustic foil instead of a resonance calculated plywood plate.

In German it is called "Folienschwinger". Literature resource about the foil resonator (sorry, german):
Book - Die Audio-Enzyklopädie: ein Nachschlagewerk für Tontechniker
From Andreas Friesecke

Position: 1.6.4.1.

http://books.google.de/books?id=r8G1oDG ... er&f=false

Best regards
Aaron

Bill Pillmore · **Posted:** Wed Feb 15, 2012 11:07 pm

aaronsommer wrote:

Bill Pillmore wrote:

Have you tried swapping L and R speakers?

Hi Bill, what do you think should happen then? :wink:

Best regards
Aaron

I am following this thread because in about a month I will be doing this to my room too. I don't know if the software eliminates the speaker from the equation or not, but because of the difference in the graphs between speakers I wanted to eliminate that as a factor.

Also the point was asked if the same slot pattern is repeated over every stud cavity on all the walls does it become more of a tuned resonator and no longer a broad band resonator?
Thanks

limsa-terry · **Posted:** Thu Feb 16, 2012 6:38 pm

Bill Pillmore wrote:

I am following this thread because in about a month I will be doing this to my room too. I don't know if the software eliminates the speaker from the equation or not, but because of the difference in the graphs between speakers I wanted to eliminate that as a factor.

Also the point was asked if the same slot pattern is repeated over every stud cavity on all the walls does it become more of a tuned resonator and no longer a broad band resonator?
Thanks

Hi Bill
It doesn't eliminate speaker but interface it does.
I tried after the first measure I took, to swapping speakers. Left speaker to the right soffit and vica versa.
Test proved that differences between the graphs is definitely coming from my room acoustics

In my room, on a back wall there's just two absorbers. Corner absorber and angled absorber. Slats in front of them are only to reflect a little high frequencies in the room.
They are not tuned devices. I could have use plastic behind the cloth to do the same thing but slats look cooler

Side walls are broad band resonators, because they're angled and the slat pattern is changing.

Your place is starting to look really cool btw!!!

Aaron
I was able to take new measurements yesterday

Before the reference measurement I angled my front cloud a bit more. It's now about 20cm lower at the front than before.
It helped a bit at the problem spots!

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Left speaker reference measurement. Looks quite good to me

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Right speaker reference measurement. It's getting better. There are still dip at the 110Hz but it's not as deep as it was before :!:

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Second measurement. Pack of rockwool in front of the right slot wall.

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Left speaker measurement. It got little worse. New dip at about 130Hz!

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Right speaker measurement. No significant improvement. Only the dip from the 110Hz moved to 100Hz.

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Third measurement. Two rockwool packs. One against the rigth slot wall and the other against the angled back wall.

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Left speaker measurement. Looks good.

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Right speaker measurement. No significant improvement.

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My front cloud is open at the back. What could happen if I put a layer of plywood on top of it??
I must try that option!

Thanks,
-Janne

limsa-terry · **Posted:** Sat Feb 25, 2012 8:24 pm

More measurements....... if anyone is interested

I made the quick test how a plywood layer on top of the cloud affects on my room responce.
Plywood was 15mm 120cm x 185cm, allmost the size of the cloud.

Here are reference measurements without the plywood layer.
Left speaker:

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and Right speaker:

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And then a plywood on top of the cloud.
Left speaker: got 5dB worse on a 170Hz.. Otherwise quite the same as reference.

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And Right speaker: 5dB better on a 110Hz but few dB worse on 170Hz..

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-Janne

aaronsommer · **Posted:** Sun Feb 26, 2012 1:01 am

Hi Janne,
This measures are strange, theres a peak at 450hz right speaker after the plywood that usually should not be there... I think you have used 50kg type rockwool for the cloude, did you? How thick?
From room inside: Fabric-> rockwool-> plywood? The mids and highs are looking very different that i guess the mic position was changed a little bit between both a/b measures.

If the 170hz frequency is really getting that bad i would drop off this sheet again.

Im still experimenting too but i have good results now, almost only one -6db peak.
I rebuilt the slot walls three times totaly. It was necessary cause the first time i used too low dense rockeool and the slotresonator acted like a reverbator on 100hz. It was really :horse:

but they are most effective now.
There is such a big difference what rockwool you use in the slot walls and how much, it is a really damn finetune work making it 8db better or even worse if there is too less rockwool.

Best
Aaron

limsa-terry · **Posted:** Sun Feb 26, 2012 1:42 am

aaronsommer wrote:

This measures are strange, theres a peak at 450hz right speaker after the plywood that usually should not be there... I think you have used 50kg type rockwool for the cloude, did you? How thick?
From room inside: Fabric-> rockwool-> plywood? The mids and highs are looking very different that i guess the mic position was changed a little bit between both a/b measures.

You're right. I used rockwool 40-50kg/m3 of density for the cloud. 10cm thick layer.
And yes, plywood was on the top of the cloud -> from room inside: fabric -> rockwool -> plywood.

I marked the measurement mic stands place on the floor with tape, but yes the mic's place can vary a few millimeters
between the measures.

Actually that peak at 450hz is in the left speakers reference measurement also.
I allways take 3 to 5 measurements at same setup and I'm choosing the best one.
Sometimes that 450hz peak is there and sometimes not..

aaronsommer wrote:

If the 170hz frequency is really getting that bad i would drop off this sheet again.

Yes maybe you're right. It got little better at 110hz on a right speaker but otherwise worse...
I'm leaving it still there and finishing the backwall and door absorbers.
Then taking new measurements, if it still looks bad at the 170hz. I'm taking it of.

aaronsommer wrote:

Im still experimenting too but i have good results now, almost only one -6db peak.
I rebuilt the slot walls three times totaly. It was necessary cause the first time i used too low dense rockeool and the slotresonator acted like a reverbator on 100hz. It was really :horse:

but they are most effective now.
There is such a big difference what rockwool you use in the slot walls and how much, it is a really damn finetune work making it 8db better or even worse if there is too less rockwool.

Oh man, I can't wait your next update

Good luck,

-Janne

limsa-terry · **Posted:** Sun Apr 01, 2012 8:24 pm

Hello all

It's been a while...
Finally got finished all the skirtings and other trims here and there.
Very time consuming work, especially when all the walls are angled

Pic 1.
Front wall finished. Sorry about the picture quality... crappy cellphone pic.

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Pics 2-4.
Additional backwall absorbers.
Construction is simple. Frame is made of 1x4" wood.
Inside filled with rockwool. In front a layer of plastic and cloth.

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Pic 5.
Back wall finished.

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Pic 6.
Entry door absorbers.
Contruction is the same than in other two backwall absorbers.

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Pics 7-8.
Couple of details

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Final measurement curves coming soon

-janne

Soundman2020 · **Posted:** Mon Apr 02, 2012 4:55 am

Of COURSE! Now I understand why you had those strange curves in your graphs! It's OBVIOUS! You have bagpipes in there!

That explains everything!!! There's no telling what kind of strange, screaming, "strangled-cat" sound they are adding to your room.... Just the sight of those is scaring the hell out of the sound waves, and makes them rush around the room, bouncing off the walls, yelling and shrieking in absolute terror and extreme fear, as they desperately try to escape ... :lol:

(Actually, I do have some Scottish blood in me, I love the sound of the bagpipes! I just couldn't resist the feeble attempt at humor...).

Seriously, the room looks great! I love the style of decoration, and I hope those new absorbers solve your problems. I'm look forward to seeing the new graphs.

- Stuart -

simo · **Posted:** Mon Apr 02, 2012 5:28 am

Hey Janne,

That room looks fantastic !
you are so close to the finishing line man,

Looking forward to your next post

simo

aaronsommer · **Posted:** Mon Apr 02, 2012 7:21 am

Nice job, the wooden frames around the traps and your room are looking great and your picture wall is even cool

Very huge!

Aaron

limsa-terry · **Posted:** Tue Apr 03, 2012 1:22 am

Stuart, Simo and Aaron.
Thanks a lot for your reeeally nice comments :mrgreen:

Stuart:
Bagpipes could be the reason of strange curves I manage to measure OR
maybe this little furry animal:

She's starting to get really pissed of about that sweeping sound... :lol:

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Ok..
Here are the final measurments:
Left and right speaker 30Hz-1000Hz.
Same problem spots but not as deep as before.
Overall I'm now about +/- 5db at the LF range.

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Left and right speakers 30Hz-15000Hz.
Octave smoothing is 1/12.

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And finally LF waterfall plots.

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I'm pretty happy with the results and pretty tired of measuring...
I wanna mix!

I do need to finnish my liveroom also. I'm sure everyone has forgotten this fact

so, construction isn't over yet...

What next:
I need to finish a little storage room next to my control room,
-finish the mixing desk,
-soldering, soldering, soldering,
-then continue the liveroom contruction...

Thanks again!
-Janne

Soundman2020 · **Posted:** Tue Apr 03, 2012 3:10 am

The graphs are looking much better. Pretty darn good, actually! +/- 5 dB is excellent for a small room like that, and I doubt that you'll be able to improve much more than that.

So go make music already!

- Stuart -

limsa-terry · **Posted:** Wed Apr 04, 2012 10:53 pm

Thanks Stuart

Your words are music to my ears :mrgreen:

-Janne

limsa-terry · **Posted:** Mon Jun 11, 2012 6:41 pm

Wow! it's been awhile since my last post...
I've been mostly recording and mixing my bands new album, and we are nearly finished.
...so the construction can continue...

Drums recorded at "real" studio but everything else, guitars, basses and some vocals (we are playing instrumental space rock

) recorded at my studio.
Everything worked perfectly fine. Mixing is a lot easier nowadays, no wonder

Mixer desk done, and my old Studiomaster mixer is fired at use also.
Some cables have to be solded but mostly everthing is wired!
I noticed that I'll have to buy a lot of new gear

I now the rule here: Pics or it didn't happend

I'll post some pics later at this evening!!!

-Janne

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