John Sayers' Recording Studio Design Forum

Hi,

(greetings from CHILE, this is my first post.. so please be kind)

finally I bought a house, and now I have a complete room for :

electric guitar playing
efects and tube amps building
amps testing (only 20W tube amps, not 100W mosters)
music creating, mixing (my music for fun)
recording me and some friends for GOOD DEMOS.

so I'm reading about BASS TRAPS, QRD difussors.... all those things I could build... but don't know (now) if the would be usefull in my room.

let me tell you about the room:
(I've added a Google Sketchup picture of it)

Concrete bottom with carpet over it (it's like a "high trafic" not think carpet)
the walls and cealing are "light contruction" with metalcon (not a single stone, brick o concrete on walls and celling, 'cause it's the third floor of a house)
in the middle there is the stairs (which is sourrounded by concrete) (a box of almoust 1,6mts x 1,7mts)

right now the room is very empty but reflects a lot of the sound it's produced inside (with some test with my amp)...

would 2" (glassfiber) bass traps or even some QRD difusors work for me to make it more "acousticly" pleaseant?

saludos...


Ricardo.

PS: I edited the post with a little more info... please, any more info that is needed please ask and i will complete it.

Hola Richon, y bienvenido!

Creerlo o no, hay varios chilenos aquí, en diferentes etapas del proceso de diseño/ construcción de sus estudios (como yo), y algunos ya terminados (como Javier).

En que parte de Chile vives? Javier y yo somos de Santiago.

Antes de nada, realmente deberías leer los “stickies” en la página principal de este sitio, especialmente referente a las “cosas que debes hacer antes de participar”. Hay varios comentarios y sugerencias referente a información que deberías indicar, para que los expertos aquí puedan contestar tus preguntas.

So welcome to the forum, but please check out the stickies, and update your thread with the information that the experts need in order to answer your questions.


- Stuart -

_________________
I want this studio to amaze people. "That'll do" doesn't amaze people.

Gracias Stuart, soy de Viña

ire a leer los pots y actualizare... de que parte dices que lea los stickies? de Acoustic? o de otra seccion?




I'll soon be updating the post with the info needed... thanks


Ricardo.

Hi Ricardo,

Right here!

viewtopic.php?f=17&t=7572

Plus the threads linked to on that one.


- Stuart -

_________________
I want this studio to amaze people. "That'll do" doesn't amaze people.

I edited the post with a little more info... please, any more info that is needed please ask and i will complete it.

PS: i've read a lot of info on how things work, so this is why i ask for some guidance to go a little more deep in what would help me.



PS2: would it be good to improve the sound to build a FAKE ground/bottom of wood to improve the bass ???

Hi there!!!

is there anybody willing to ask for more info?

check out this design and construction.

viewtopic.php?f=11&t=13069&start=0

wow, excellent post..


but this is way more than i'm aiming for.


First: my goal is to make a better recording/mixing in one room only.

this is why i think i'll have to put some BASS TRAPS o something else to improove the sound in the room.


The post is way to complex for my plans in the future as i want to record myself and my wife only.

And the loudest would be a 20W tube amp , everything else would be acoustic.


I've read a lot here on styckies and other pages, about construction and this and that, but i think the real question is:

is there a way to know if i need basstrapss and where to put them (on which part of the wall) or should I do this just by trial and mistake???

If it is just bass traps that you need, the answer is easy: The most effective place for bass traps in the room corners, and you will need as much as you possibly can, within reason. Search the forum for the term "superchunk", read through some of those threads, and you'll see how to do it.

But are you sure that bass traps is all you'll need? That seems unlikely...

It all depends on what you are planning to do in your room as well. How loud are you? How quiet do you need to be outside? Do you plan to record and mix in there, or is this just a practice room? What kinds of instruments are you planning to play in there?

Even a 20 watt amp can make a lot of noise...

Probably not. 2" is not very thick! When you research "superchunk" you'll see what a real bass trap looks like. And diffusers would not be a good idea in such a small room: it isn't big enough for the diffusers to have much effect. Absorption is a much better idea, especially considering that you already said that you have echo and resonance issues in there.

I'd say that, assuming this is just a practice room, your basic plan should be to have superchunks in at least 4 of the 12 corners in that room, being the front two (floor to ceiling) and the back two (floor to ceiling), following the roof line angles in your walls as much as possible. Then to treat the vertical sections of the walls with absorption, starting with maybe 25% coverage to see how well that works, and increasing as necessary. Perhaps do it in a "checkerboard" pattern, so it looks better aesthetically, but the idea is that you have absorption on one wall exactly opposite a section of hard surface on the other wall.

I'd also take off the carpet and replace it with laminate floor (incorrectly called "piso flotante" here in Chile, even though it is not actually floating floor at all!), and put an absorbent cloud on your ceiling, covering at least on third of the surface to start with, then adding more if necessary. You could also put some absorption on the angled ceiling sections, if necessary.

If that were my room, I'd start with that, then measure the result acoustically to see where your remaining problems are, and treat those as needed.

You should be able to do that for a few hundred lucas, I reckon (not more than half a million at most). You can make all of the absorption from rockwool ("lana mineral") or normal pink fiberglass insulation (check for best prices at Easy, Home Center, Sodimac, Construmart, etc.), or even use the semi-rigid panels that Volcán makes now, which seem to be similar to 703. You can frame the superchunks with wood and stretch thin cloth over the frame, and do the same for the side absorber panels.

In other words, you can do all the work yourself, with a hammer and some nails. That will keep the costs down a lot.

Of course, none of this will isolate your room, but you did not mention any problems with neighbors or family, so I assume that you do not need isolation, and your only problem is room acoustics?


- Stuart -

_________________
I want this studio to amaze people. "That'll do" doesn't amaze people.

Hola Richon!

Stuart pretty much said it all. And also remember that symmetry is a must. Everything should be like a mirror.
I recommend you read Ethan's website, He also explains a lot about first reflection points, etc

_________________
http://www.estudiosbassino.cl

that's exactly what I wanted to explain..

I don't have problems with neighbours or with sound "leaving" the room to other rooms of the house.

The room is 4,3Mts wide X 7,6mts long x 2,4mts high (I still thing it's not that small, isn't it??)


the goal for me is to make it a better room for practices and record acoustic music.

only sometimes my DIY 20W tube amp played normal (not dimed)


So, in resume , I'll check:
-Superchunks and basstraps
-reflection points
-floor


PS: why avoiding the CARPET?? would a 3mts X 4mts FLOATING FLOOR over the CARPET help something?

PS: I've added a better version of the Sketchup from my Third floor

Carpet is selective. In other words, it absorbs some frequencies more than others, usually absorbing much more highs than lows. So your room will sound dull, muddy, honky, etc. The problem with carpet is that you do not know WHAT frequencies it is absorbing, and which ones it is not affecting! Unless the manufacturer of your carpet has published the coefficients of absorption for that specific carpet, you have no idea what it is doing to your room! So you need to get rid of it somehow

It MIGHT help, but I'm not sure that putting laminate floor on top of carpet is a good idea. Laminate floor must be laid over a perfectly flat surface, or else it will crack / warp. I don't know enough about laminate floor to be sure (xSpace probably does), but to me it does not sound like a practical solution. Much better to take out the carpet, level the floor, and lay the laminate correctly.

- Stuart -

_________________
I want this studio to amaze people. "That'll do" doesn't amaze people.