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PostPosted: Mon Oct 11, 2010 3:02 am 
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Location: Northern Illinois
thanks soundman for the suggestion.
the current room setup will change until i get another computer desk setup.
sometime you gotta work with what you got. and i got this setup. excuse the crude drawing.
from my previous photos nothing has changed. however, the sound is much better than before, although my mix front is in a corner. the speakers are facing the length of the room. I know i will not get "studio" quality sound. but this is a multi-purpose room; recording instruments and vox, mixing, working and listening. i know with the amount of absorption in the room i will be able to produce a good demo mix.
sometimes you gotta make what you have work.

by the way, no disrespect; was your suggestion based upon personal preference or science theory? i've seen my photo examples of room setups and a corner setup similar to mine was in a few examples.
just a question, no disrespect.
thanks


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PostPosted: Mon Oct 11, 2010 4:25 am 
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"by the way, no disrespect; was your suggestion based upon personal preference or science theory?"

Panel Vibrations are known to converge in the corners, that is the science used. And then when you place all the things that make vibrations into the corner you have an environment that creates loss of highs and an increase of lows that are too difficult to overcome when mixing. It's taking a bad situation and making it worse :)

Any corner setup you have seen, that has been in the corner of a rectangular room had the same issue your room has and is generally frowned upon as a placement area and is never recommended by anyone with any experience.


Now a corner that has been modified in some respects, E.G. hard boundary installed to actually remove the corner and make the existing 90 degree side walls "splayed" has been used with effectiveness.

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PostPosted: Mon Oct 11, 2010 7:25 am 
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"Now a corner that has been modified in some respects, E.G. hard boundary installed to actually remove the corner and make the existing 90 degree side walls "splayed" has been used with effectiveness

Can you translate ...
make the existing 90 degree side walls "splayed"


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PostPosted: Mon Oct 11, 2010 9:20 am 
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whoa soundman,
i think i understand. perhaps, i don't need to move the furniture, just the re-arrange the monitor placement. instead of having the monitors spread across the corner, move the monitors to the back wall to fire down the length. for example in the items on the right in the photo will be remove or relocated and replaced with the monitors.
Is that what you mean ...
... if so ...
...Doh!!!
Also, the speaker placement would be more center to the room.
keep you posted.


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PostPosted: Mon Oct 11, 2010 9:50 am 
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Exactly: Get your monitors out of the corner, and centered in the room, firing down the long axis. In your case, that means moving the desk so that it is facing the window (which includes rotating the desk 45° clockwise). That will put your speakers in a much better position. As Brien already explained, corners do bad things to your sound, acoustically, which is why you never want to have speakers in a corner. You get all kinds of artifacts from the way sound bounces around between the surfaces: comb filtering, reinforcement of bass, nulling of highs, multiple reflections, etc. You will never be able to get a decent mix with speakers in the corner. Maybe you have seem entire control rooms set up in a corner, but that is always done the other way around, where the corner is at the BACK of the room, still leaving a wide flat surface at the front. As Brien said, you won't ever see a great studio with the desk and speakers sitting in an untreated corner. At the very least you need a large hard surface across the diagonal, with suitable treatment on it.

On the other hand, if you move your desk to face the window, setting it in the middle of the room, then you can get a pretty good setup. I would also suggest that you get your speakers off the desk and put them on very heavy stands just behind the desk. Hollow sand-filled stands seem popular right now, but any kind of very massive stand will do. If your speakers are resting on the desk, then they cause the entire desk to vibrate in sympathy at some frequencies, and cancel out other frequencies. You'll also get reflections off your desk. Plus, your desk isn't big enough to get the speakers far enough apart form each other, and far enough away from your head, to create a good sound stage and stereo image. Ideally, your speakers should be about 1.5m to 2m apart, and the same distance from your ears: in other words, your head and the speakers should be at the three points of an equilateral triangle. Your speakers are also too low: they should be at about 1.2 m above the floor, which is roughly the same height that your ears are above the floor. The speakers should point at your ears. So look for solid, massive speaker stands that are a bit less than 1.2 high (so the speakers axes ends up at 1.2m).

Then I'd set up one of those absorption panels right up against the wall behind each speaker, another in the middle between them (up against the window), two more diagonally across the front corners of the room, floor to ceiling, like Glenn said, another two on the side walls at the first reflection points, and a few more on the wall behind you.

Do that and I reckon you'll be amazed at the difference on your sound! It might not be world-class, but I bet it will be immensely better than it is right now! :)


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PostPosted: Mon Oct 11, 2010 10:37 am 
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whoa soundman,
i think i understand. the speaker placement would be more center to the room.
moving the desk would take away much needed space, long one wall as the room is compact. i may recover space near one window and lose space by the other window.
the acoustic panels will stay in place as in they are in the photo.
but looks as though i have a major project on my hands to take apart and set the desk; 3 pieces.
or purchase another desk, this time one piece like the Omnirax Presto 4 Studio Desk $600.00 USD

keep you posted.


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PostPosted: Tue Oct 12, 2010 11:13 am 
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new setup photos with new desk.
desk is in the facing the center of the front wall with the speaker a bit further than with the old desk. moved speakers out of the corner.
Sound is different; bass not as boomly in certain portions of several of my mixes. Which is good.
however, i did notice some of my background keys were 'way in the mix'. i need to listen to the mix more to determine whether this is a good thing or remix. overall new sound takes getting familiar. Next step is to get speaker stands. but don't know where and how to place them. one good thing, the desk is easier to move.
looking for more feedback, if you like ...

... not giving up!


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PostPosted: Tue Oct 12, 2010 3:48 pm 
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Quote:
moved speakers out of the corner.
Sound is different; bass not as boomly in certain portions of several of my mixes. Which is good.
Great! That "boomy" sound was definitely due to having your speakers in the corner, where you were most likely getting all kinds of strange artifacts. The way you have them now you are hearing a much "truer" response.

You still need more treatment on the walls: You might still be getting comb-filtering artifacts from reflections off the front wall, and you still need more bass trapping, but you at least have a good start. If you make more absorber panels, make them thicker and larger. At least 4" thick, and as big as you can afford (wide and tall).

One question: Is the desk centered on that wall? Room symmetry is very important to creating a good sound stage, so you should have your desk exactly centered, with your speakers exactly the same distance to the left and right of the center line.

- Stuart -

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PostPosted: Tue Oct 12, 2010 8:24 pm 
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Quote:
One question: Is the desk centered on that wall? Room symmetry is very important to creating a good sound stage, so you should have your desk exactly centered, with your speakers exactly the same distance to the left and right of the center line.


Yep. measured, measured and remeasured. keep you post up for reference.
Desk is sitting center to the front wall. don't know how much more panels to add without covering the entire wall, unless you are referring to a cloud overhead ...


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PostPosted: Tue Oct 19, 2010 9:16 am 
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do you have a cloud? if not. it will definitely help.

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