John Sayers' Recording Studio Design Forum

Please note - I started 4 separate threads at the outset of this adventure.
This one - viewtopic.php?f=2&t=17296 - Triple leaf

viewtopic.php?f=2&t=17294 - Please help with options for room within room -
viewtopic.php?f=2&t=17302 - Should I use (denser) 13ml soundchek or 16mm fyrcheck?

And what became my main thread for ongoing discussion - viewtopic.php?f=2&t=17298 Does this count as a 'leaf'





Hi there - I was gunning down the room within a room route until I got an email last night warning against creating a triple leaf situation - that is, wall-gap-wall-gap-wall.
And I'm just wondering - how on earth do you create a room within a room without ending up with a triple leaf situation!
Thank you
Peter

Hi Peter. welcome. Please check the posting rules: you seem to be missing something important!

"Two-leaf room-in-a-room" is a simple concept once you get it, but not so easy to get your head around. Basically it means that you have two "leaves", and ONLY two leaves around you on all sides, where "leaf" just means a bunch of mass built up from one or more sheets of drywall, plywood, MDF, osb, etc.

If you are building from scratch, it's easy to do: You pour your foundation / slab, put up some 2x4 framing around the edge, stick one leaf on the outer side of that frame, then build another frame, an inch or so away from the first, and stick your second leaf on the inner side of that. Done!

But if you have an existing building, then things are more complex. For example, if you wanted to build your studio in your living room: the existing living room walls already have two leaves on them: They are stud frames with drywall on both sides. Clearly, if you build more framing and add another leaf, you now have 3, which is not so good. The answer is to simply remove the drywall from your living room walls, exposing the studs! Now you are down to one leaf, so you can build your second frame, add your drywall, and you have two leaves.

The same applies to the ceiling, walls, and doors, but that's a bit more complex...


- Stuart -

_________________
I want this studio to amaze people. "That'll do" doesn't amaze people.

Thank you for getting back to me.
So the room in question (as it stands) has:
Wall one - a single layer of drywall, then an air gap (no insulation) 3-12 inches variable, then a single layer of brick (the outside of the house)
Wall two - drywall to stud with drywall on the other side of the stud (this wall separates the music room from another room) with insulation in between
Wall three - same as wall two
Wall four - drywall directly on concrete retaining wall (up to chest height) and then, recessed into the space above the retaining wall (my speakers are going in there) some yellow-tongue flooring boards used to create cupboards)
The room is on the lower level of a house on a steep block - hence one wall being against the concrete retaining wall under the house!
Ceilling - drywall attached directly to the timber joists that support the house above - the tongue-n-groove flooring of the upper level sits directly on these joists and there is a timber hardwood floor directly on this tongue and groove flooring.
And at this stage - there is double layer (that is two sheets stuck together) 13ml gyprock on all walls.
So - on walls 1, 2 and 3, and in the ceilling I effectively have a double leaf (though the wall one gap is very irregular - so I don't know if you would get resonance) - therefore if I create a room within the room I will have a triple leaf construction.
What do you think I could /should do next!
The main issue is trying to make it so you cannot hear my trombone practice in the house above - and noise through the ceilling is the main problem.
The second issue is noise through the wall 1 to my neighbours - whose kids both sleep on our side of their house near my trombone practice room.
The third, is to stop noise travelling under the house to the kids rooms that are up and behind the music room. This seems to be dealt with quite well by the cupboard arrangement I have made down there.
P

The more I think about this - particularly in respect to the ceilling, I am wondering if I have to worry about a potential triple layer here at all....as the 'gap' between the current drywall ceilling and the floor above is so broken up into sections - it is not one big 'gap'.

My ceilling is drywall attached to joists - these joists are an even width apart (16"-20" is probably right) with cross pieces randomly inserted (to stop the joists twisting) and the joists are about 10-11" in 'height'. I.e. the distance from the drywall layers to the bottom of the flooring above is about 10-11".

So, given that the 'air' between the drywall ceilling and the floor above is broken up into many sections (of different sizes) and given that the gap is 10-11". Do I need to worry about this being a potential triple leaf system were I to build a false ceiling below it?

It would be quite easy for me to construct a false ceilling (frame) say 6" below the current drywall ceilling and attach new drywall to this. And if that existing-drywall-to-floor gap isn't an issue, then this would be the way to go!

Thanks again for your great help!

Peter