John Sayers' Recording Studio Design Forum

Aloha Aaron,

Congratulations and Happy Birthday to you!

May you have many more great and productive years ahead!

Aloha

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Jerry Maguire: Help me... help you. Help me, help you.

Thanks Kendale!


Well, I have some bad news regarding the buzz issue. I called Mackie, I called another tech, and we are officially at a consensus with this setup...

I'M F***ED!

Transformers are going to be the only solution.

(actually there is 1 other solution. A balanced console.)

Sadly, this is an issue with a number of new systems... Protools included. They don't interface well with unbalanced equipment. One solution is to build an unbalanced line driver, which would be cheaper than transformers, and wouldn't color the sound as much. I am dealing with a similar issue here with a Helios rebuild. The Helios is totally unbalanced and we are searching for ways to interface with active balanced outputs that won't impact the sound too much.

Check out this tread over on PSW:

http://recforums.prosoundweb.com/index.php/t/9030/0/

Best of luck! I feel your pain!

Dave.

Here you go, Aaron...



Please let me know if there's anything else I can do for you.

Sincerely,

--Keith

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"Converting a garage into living space requires a city permit . . . homeowners insurance won't cover a structure that's been changed without a building permit . . ." --Sacramento Bee, May 27, 2006

Hi Dave,

Yeah, that's been the unfortunate discovery of this headache. I was told by another tech about this a couple months back when I first started having this issue, but wanted to try all possibilities.

And what a bummer!!!!!!! And I thought modern technology was suppose to make our lives easier. Whoever said that...well, I'll refrain from posting my thoughts on that.


Hey Sharward, are those the "original" metal transformers, or newer plastic ones?

On another note, I guess I'm going to have to do the alternative for now. Either run the signals through the tape machine in "Input" mode and use it as a buffer, OR transfer the tracks to tape and mixdown from tape. (Which is going to cost some $$$ since I need to get it fully up and running, aligned, and buy a new alignment tape.)

Meanwhile, I guess it's time to start getting a biz plan together and talk w/ some banks, or finish out this construction, get a new appraisal on the house and get an equity loan. (This was my original plan anyways for getting a console).

So in other words, I'm keeping my eyes open for my own console. Choices would be a Trident 80B or C, Neve, API, or something in that realm. But I really like Tridents after working on Roger Waters old console.

That's my world at the moment.

Oh, man -- it looks like you're really in a pickle...

I wouldn't have been so silly had I known.

I'm totally clueless about recording equipment... Seems like a royal headache to me......

--Keith

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"Converting a garage into living space requires a city permit . . . homeowners insurance won't cover a structure that's been changed without a building permit . . ." --Sacramento Bee, May 27, 2006

Yeah, at least I have a temporary work around so I can mix this album.

Aaron
I checked the SAE section on this site, but I need some clarification. I'm just curious to know when we say "unbalanced equipment" that causes the problem of "humming"are we referring to mixers and other outboard equipment only? In other words, if I understand the idea correctly, it's better to have a balanced system throughout your whole setup (balanced mixer, trs cables, xlr cables, compressors that use trs/xlr etc etc). If you plug in a keyboard that does not have a balanced signal or cable, is that signal unbalanced through the mixer and into any outboard equipment you use in processing that signal? Isn't a guitar connected to a mixer an unbalanced signal? Or, does it depend on if the cable you use in connecting the guitar is balanced or unbalanced? I'm also wondering where DI (direct boxes) come into this factor.

To sum it up...if you have a mixer that accepts a balanced signal, outputs a balanced signal and all your other equipment is balanced, if you plug in a guitar or keyboard using a trs cable, will the signal coming into the board be balanced or unbalanced?

Thanx!

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Take Care and GOD Bless
Stan

In this case, it is the connection of the hard disc recorder output (with active balanced out) to the unbalanced input of the Soundcraft console that is causing the problem. In some cases, balanced output amps cause problems when they are "unbalanced" by the destination input... hum, buzz, loss of low end, loss of level etc. With more equipment coming with balanced connections, manufacturers are not taking unbalanced equipment into consideration when designing these output stages. Your example of a guitar is connecting an unbalanced *output* to a balanced *input*... this does not create a problem as you are not shorting out, or floating any part of the signal line. Using tranformers is the only "fool proof" method of connecting the gear because you can match the output and input impedances properly. You also have full electrical isolation between equipment that eliminates any noise. In older unblanced consoles, they would place transformers on the echo and FB send/returns due to the long cable runs involved. Mic inputs would typically have transformers on the inputs as well because of cable length, but the tape sends and returns would not. The close proximity of the tape decks to the consoles didn't generally warrant the cost of adding a full set of input and output transformers. In this case, Aaron has to either actively unbalance the system, install transformers on the HDR outputs (only), or (as he has suggested) buffer the signal through another device that has balanced inputs, and outputs that are not susceptable to unbalancing problems.

Dave.

Dave, that's the best summed up version of the problem in a nutshell. Thank You.

Yeah, I didn't have any problems going to the HDR. No buzz or ground loops recorded on the tracks. Just the return.

I hope to have the 2" machine up and running this afternoon. Randy Blevins was over this morning tweaking the machine. We blew a fuse on one of the power supplies, and he had to run off to another client to repair a master module for someone. He should be back this afternoon and hopefully we'll get the machine aligned. (had some bias card issues back in January when I was trying to align it.

So my work around for this will be one of two options. 1. Just put the 2" machine in "Input" mode and have the signal pass through it, or; 2. dump the tracks to tape and mix off tape (preferred for obvious sound reasons). I'm actually looking forward to mixing off tape again. Yippie!

Ahh...the sweet sound of analog!

I just realized I hadn't posted any pix recently. (not that I've done much the last few weeks).

A few weeks back, I filled in the hole w/ concrete. Rebuilt the wall for the bathroom, and leveled the floor. There are some additional pictures I haven't taken yet, but will try and maybe take some this weekend.

Here's the stuff from the week before the party. (about 3 weeks ago).

And actually there's more done than these pix show. I've since finished the plumbing (except installing the toilet...waiting on my new flooring).

Greetings all.

Things have been hectic lately, and I hadn't posted for over a month now. Hopefully this will change in the coming weeks. And I hope these recent health developments don't put a damper on things...but that's another story.

I have some updates. I finished laying the marble in the studio bathroom. Finally put in the grout last night. Will wait a couple days and then seal it.

Good news. Finished my first project in the studio. Tracked early this year (Feb./March). Been busy mixing the last few weeks, And just finished remixing the entire thing this last weekend. It goes to mastering and duplication this week. Yippie! They're very happy w/ the album. And they look forward to coming back to do some more.

Now if I can just finish this studio out, all will be great.

The biggest budget stuff is yet to come. HVAC ducts, Glass Windows, a few more doors, floors, ceiling, the Trim Out, and of course...acoustics.

I estimate probably another $10k+/- to finish it out.

There's the news.

Congrats on the progress, Aaron!

What "health developments?" Please share if you wish... Or not... It's up to you (obviously).

Hey, some friends of ours are moving to the Nashville area in a few months, once they sell their home here. They're ready for a new environment: husband used to work for Tower Records' headquarters (R.I.P.) and his unemployment just ran out, so he's hoping to stay in teh music biz. Wife's a barista at the ubiquitous Starbucks, so she'll have no trouble. Teen daughter likely to have major culture shock. Yet another California family refugee.

--Keith

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"Converting a garage into living space requires a city permit . . . homeowners insurance won't cover a structure that's been changed without a building permit . . ." --Sacramento Bee, May 27, 2006

Thanks Keith.



Lots of pain in my left abdomin. It's been coming and going since about Sept/Oct. last year, but the last 3-4 weeks, it's been miserable. The docs got me back on pain stuff again. (Man, I'm sick of pills).

The CT scan came back as normal. Blood work shows a couple things abnormal. Pancreas to be exact. Not enough enzymes for digestion. But I've been on this medication for nearly 2 weeks now, and not much difference, and still pain, so I think there's something else going on. I have a gut feeling I may end up under the knife. But that's hopefully a last resort.





Have 'em look me up if they want. Teen daughter...culture shock...THAT'S AN UNDERSTATEMENT!

When I moved hear 10 years ago from Seattle, I literally felt I was in another country. No kidding.

I love it now, but it took about a year and a half, maybe two, to really fully adapt.

It is a culture shock coming from the west coast.

Ugh. So sorry you're going through that, Aaron. The "not knowing" has to be so frustrating. Hang in there.

--Keith

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"Converting a garage into living space requires a city permit . . . homeowners insurance won't cover a structure that's been changed without a building permit . . ." --Sacramento Bee, May 27, 2006