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PostPosted: Thu Mar 04, 2021 3:29 am 
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Location: Türkiye/Istanbul
Hello. My name is Kürşat. I live in Turkey. I built a studio. My country is a bit inexperienced in this field and I did my research in different countries. I'm very new to this site. I would like to tell you about the work I have done and to ask for help. Maybe you can tell me about your experiences. I have limited time left. I have to complete the building. This studio is my first experience and this is inside a music school. My own workplace and 180m2. I designed 2 classrooms with 15m2 area and a 50m2 house. This is the 2nd floor. There is a supermarket downstairs. My workplace was just an empty shop with columns. I divided these columns into rooms with drywall. I drew a small plan and presented it in the attachment. I put a single drywall profile and 5cm low density knauf mineral wool in the classrooms and covered them with a single layer of drywall.
I set up the studio recording room in the middle of these two classrooms. All three sides of my workplace are covered with aluminum framed glass. Exterior sounds car sounds come in. I closed the recording room by putting styrofoam on the glass part and aerated concrete in front of it. I covered the wall with 7.5 cm galvanized single profile and 5 cm rock wool and gypsum-mlv-gypsum board. The other 2 sides of the recording room are adjacent to the classrooms. These 3 walls are 2x7.5 cm profiles and the profiles are non-contact, covered with 15 cm rock wool and gypsum-mlv-gypsum board.
The reason I use MLV is that green glue is very expensive here. MLV is much cheaper here. I used 2.5mm mlv. I guess there is no green glue alternative for damping here. There are also no flexible channels. Some of the things you have implemented are missing here. Acoustic caulk is also not of good quality. I found it difficult and it was a bit expensive.
The control room I set up on the opposite side of the recording room is 8 m2. The corridor runs between the two rooms. Windows may only be at the door, I haven't reached that stage yet. The control room is angular. Like a mastering room but with a flat top. Since the walls have apartment space at the rear, there is only one profile there. It contains 10 cm of mineral wool. Coated with Gyp-mlv-gyp. Other cheeks are single profile, inside 5 cm mineral wool. Drywall on one side. its inner wall is inside the Gyp-mlv-gyp.
The ceiling was making mistakes in both studios. There are long concrete beams under the screed on the ceilings, and the 60cm gap between them was covered with plaster screed by gluing styrofoam. I placed a 7.5 cm ceiling profile and mineral wool under it. I glued mlv under the plasterboard. Mlv's are 1m2 in size and I fixed it with glue. There are no screws anywhere between the two drywalls. In this case, the ceiling is single drywall and mlv. But just in case, I posted a new profile below and left it blank. I plan to put mineral wool in it and cover it with fabric.
There are concrete beams under the ceiling and styrofoam and screed plaster at the end. The floor is built like a ceiling and there is faience on the screed concrete. I haven't done anything yet.
I have two PVC doors that I bought from an old studio. 4-16-4mm gas glass and 90% glass covered. I want 2 more. I designed my door for double door.
Do I have to install a floor under these circumstances? Should it be separate for both rooms? Does the fabric I planned on the ceiling make sense and spoil the acoustics? Is additional insulation required for walls? What can you suggest? I will also accept your suggestion about the doors.
I am sorry, my English is not good. I am writing this article with a translator. Thank you very much in advance. I cannot measure the resonance of my rooms. I only took measurements of 50-55 db during the day, 40-50 db in the evening and 30 db at night only if there is no door. There may be 1 db increase when I put it down.


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PostPosted: Fri Mar 05, 2021 5:20 am 
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Location: Old Tappan, NJ USA
welcome!

have you done any examination of the noise levels coming from outside after doing the work? it would be the best indicator of success or where additional factors need to be taken into consideration.

not sure what else could be done - adding to the floor might be useful to reducing impact noise downstairs.

the control room is tiny - so lining the room with insulation and cloth is about all you can do.

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PostPosted: Fri Mar 05, 2021 6:58 am 
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Hello Glenn. I haven't ordered my doors yet. If I add layer to the floor for impact noise, it will rise a little. I have to order the door according to this size.Despite being without a door, I can only feel the noise diminish considerably. I only hear the voices through the doorway. First of all, how much should I add to the floor and what could these products be? I have 18mm mdf layer and mlv extra. Is it necessary to spread foam or cork for impact? How many cm should I raise on average? Also, do such foam and soft products count as air voids? I don't want to do anything wrong at the last stage. When I finish the floor, I would like to install the doors and share the result with you. What kind of impact noise is made when the ground is not floating? Thanks.

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PostPosted: Fri Mar 05, 2021 4:18 pm 
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if the door could be modified later and you can adjust the threshold, then you could put the doors in and see what levels you might still be dealing with and then add additional flooring. from an impact attenuation - it's for the people downstairs who hear impact noises from your movements etc. however, if the floor are thin and you need additional mass on them to reduce sound coming in from below via the flooring, then i would add that now. a layer of rubber (perhaps the MLV) and then the MDF or plywood.

one thought - if you can obtain a mechanics stethoscope, you could determine what is coming through the floor in various spots in your space. just listening to the sounds coming via the flooring would help assess what the next step is.

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PostPosted: Fri Mar 05, 2021 7:26 pm 
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Location: Westminster MA USA
gullfo wrote:

one thought - if you can obtain a mechanics stethoscope, you could determine what is coming through the floor in various spots in your space. just listening to the sounds coming via the flooring would help assess what the next step is.


An old mechanics trick is to just use a long screwdriver so you don't even need the stethoscope. I can easily identify a bad bearing even with a loud engine running with a screwdriver. Tip on what you want to isolate and handle pressed up to your ear. Trickier around a running engine than a studio.

I don't have much acoustic expertise to contribute to this forum but I'm not without talents.


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PostPosted: Sat Mar 06, 2021 5:30 am 
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Location: Türkiye/Istanbul
Hello Glenn. The doors have been ordered. I do what you say. I will do my tests after the doors are installed. If not enough, I will have a 7 cm elevation. Two doors will be installed. I have a strong feeling that I will not need much insulation for the floor. I learned that the supermarket downstairs will not be disturbed by the music we will make. It is not a very noisy place. We'll find out when the door is stuck. Thank you for your interest.

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PostPosted: Sat Mar 06, 2021 6:00 am 
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BackEastDon wrote:
gullfo wrote:

one thought - if you can obtain a mechanics stethoscope, you could determine what is coming through the floor in various spots in your space. just listening to the sounds coming via the flooring would help assess what the next step is.


An old mechanics trick is to just use a long screwdriver so you don't even need the stethoscope. I can easily identify a bad bearing even with a loud engine running with a screwdriver. Tip on what you want to isolate and handle pressed up to your ear. Trickier around a running engine than a studio.

I don't have much acoustic expertise to contribute to this forum but I'm not without talents.

My English is a little poor. I use a translator most of the time. I apologize for not understanding. Should I touch a screwdriver to the floor and hold it to my ear?

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PostPosted: Wed Mar 24, 2021 8:24 am 
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Hello Glenn. Doors are installed today. I measure 30-35 db sound in the room at my controls. the source of the noise is the ceiling, and the window is sourced from the single profile wall, where I knit the window with ytong and the air gap is 7.5 cm. There is the sound of heels from the floor. because the floor was covered with 180 m2 of tiles. it is very difficult to change it inside the shop. Since my ceiling is not very high, there is a 7.5 cm air gap from a single profile and a single plasterboard and under it there is a mlv. I feel a little depressed.
There is an extra profile 10 cm under the ceiling and I keep it open. I did not fill it to avoid the triple leaf effect. Does it help if I fill rock wool into it like a diffuser and hammer wood with air gaps? Will acoustic treatment also have an effect on reducing sound? Because the room reverberates. What I can do from now on is rock wool and lath to the ceiling, mlv and laminate flooring to the floor, acoustic treatment to the interior and exterior walls. I'm trying to do something without adding mass to the walls. Do you have a suggestion?

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PostPosted: Wed Mar 24, 2021 10:16 am 
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you can fill all air gaps with insulation, just do not pack it tightly. some additional mass on the ceiling may help a bit. absorption in the room can lower the overall level in the room which of course can help with the transmission loss but its not going to be a lot.

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PostPosted: Wed Mar 24, 2021 4:20 pm 
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I understand, Glenn. Does the density of the mineral or rockwool I fill is important? I have knauf 16 m3 less. I read that a max of 40 m3 is recommended for bass absorption. After all, I will fill the ceiling around 10 cm. If it works like Bass Trap, I'll fill it up accordingly.

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PostPosted: Thu Mar 25, 2021 12:58 am 
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in general 24kg/m3 is considered the lightest stuff - 16kg/m3 may work if its a long fiber insulation, and this will help with the bass. otherwise the 40kg/m3 will generally work.

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PostPosted: Thu Mar 25, 2021 2:47 am 
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I have a 10 cm height margin for the ceiling. If I fill it with 10 cm 40 kg / m3 rockwool and cross slats in diffuser logic on it, will my ceiling work like a broadband acoustic panel?

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PostPosted: Thu Mar 25, 2021 2:59 am 
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somewhat - yes

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PostPosted: Sat Mar 27, 2021 7:12 am 
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Hi, Glenn. I think this is the name. Please warn if I'm wrong. I always call out to you, I don't have any friends here. So sorry really.
Yes. As of today, I placed 10 cm 40kg rock wool on the ceiling. Most of the voices are coming from the ground. I think I need to raise a little bit. I have 3.5 cm right and I am very undecided what to put.
The noise of the room is usually 30 db during the day. It was around 34 db inside for loud noises coming from outside. At night, the room is around 28-29 db.Do these tiny voices in my ears spoil my recording? Should I add more mass. I think I can go 1 layer of drywall from inside. Is there any chance I could reach 25 db?
By the way, I want to share a little detail. I noticed that the aerated concrete wall adjacent to the plasterboard wall I knitted for the door width in the recording room performed lower.Do you have any idea why its performance was poor even though it was mass, man?

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PostPosted: Sat Mar 27, 2021 11:04 am 
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You have more friends here dolbytx! When measuring SPL the A rating ignores all Bass, all LF. I am in a Prosumer studio, a house in an estate. We are in lockdown so really no traffic or activity outside tonight. My quiet room is measuring (iPhone NIOSH App) 32-35dBC and simultaneously 26dBA. Very quiet, I can hear the hiss of air molecules hitting my eardrums!

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